Episode 125: Conversation with Darren Kornelis (Part 1)

"Even the seminary faculty can be super orthodox, but if the pastors aren't, the people aren't and things get messy. So we want to hold a high bar of theological knowledge for our pastors. We need them to know God and what he's done. And we want them to know that deeply." -Darren Kornelis

Summary of This Episode

On this episode of the Messy Reformation, Jason and Willy are joined by Rev. Darren Kornelis. Darren is the pastor of Niekerk CRC in Holland, Michigan. He is a lifelong member of the CRC, growing up in Visalia, California, attending Calvin University, and then Calvin Theological Seminary (CTS). Having experienced on both the edge and now in the “Jerusalem” of the CRC, Darren shares that while he’s felt part of the denomination in both places, west Michigan can feel insular and tends to have a greater loyalty to the institutions.

From there, conversation turns to Darren’s sense of call and time at the seminary. Darren noted he felt his call was very gradual and always great fear and trepidation. He grew up loving Bible classes and wanting to talk about the Bible, so headed to college expecting to follow in his family’s footsteps by becoming a teacher. He recognized that he loved theology classes more than education, and began taking intentional steps towards seminary where he felt validated and called to congregational ministry. 

Jason identifies that he and Darren were at CTS during the same time frame—Jason as a distance-student and Darren as an in-residence student. While those experiences are different, they picked up on similar themes at that time. While it was an enjoyable four years from Darren during which he had good experiences with several faculty who retired, he struggled with some of the changes that the changing of the guard seemed to entail. The pendulum swung in the 2010s from seminary being focused on rigorous theological education to a more “professional,” practical education. Darren sees a need for both parts to be included.

Swinging from one focus to the other has had an effect on who pursues education and training at CTS and for what vocational goals. Darren notes, “It seemed like it’s turning the pastorate into a glorified social worker.” He had classmates who want to alleviate and help people in dire situations—which isn’t bad, but there’s some confusion over what the pastorate is. In his classmates, he saw the desire to help others but not wanting to preach. Jason noticed two similar types of pastors that seem to be produced in recent years. One is the “activist” pastor—an influencer, one who rallies the people on a cause. The other is a psychologist or counselor-type—they listen to needs and hurts and walk with.

What is a pastor or, as Darren identifies, what is the primary function of the office? Jason shares the verses that focus him. One is Ephesians 4:11-12, where we told that God has given pastors or “shepherds and teachers, to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ…” Is counseling part of that? Yes. Is helping people with problems part of that? Yes. But what sets those in this work and calling apart is that pastors equip saints for ministry themselves. How pastors do that is in line with 2 Timothy 3:16—teaching and applying Scripture which “is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness…”

With the swing in curriculum, a person might be convinced they’re completely equipped with all the skills to lead their congregation, right? No, and Darren elaborates, “You learn by being thrown into it. They [seminary] can only go so far.” That’s not totally a knock on CTS, as Jason shares, similar to parenting, “We don’t know what we’re doing.” When we’re shepherding or when we’re making decisions at Synod, we’re trying to figure it out. We learn on-the-job, thus why the apprenticeship model is so important for pastors-in-training. There was something to the 1-year mentored ministry with a single congregation model as part of one’s seminary education. All that said, not having all the skills when a pastor begins ought not paralyze us or prevent us from taking action and living into our calling.